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Discussion Starter #1
* Long post alert but well worth reading*

As you all know, I've been tinkering in my ******* (inspired by Ninasky & GoddessOfEarth). Before testing sepi-white, I was experimenting with home made HQ creams. I got ahold of a large jar (the size of a pickle jar!) of raw 100% HQ crystalline 'powder' from a local woman I ran into at random who happens to have a photo studio. It was inexpensive so that meant I could afford to experiment freely w/o worrying about the cost of wasting it. She has a steady supply so when I eventually run out, I can easily get more from her.

I was using the SW cream I made all over EXCEPT on one area. There, I was testing a home blend.

In the past, I experienced the same frustrations as other compounders did with HQ. My formulations de-emuslified
. Some of them rapidly turned brown
. Some were impractical (too drying, sat on the skin & didn't absorb etc) Sooo.....

I looked at base creams that were proven scientifically to actually absorb! The clear winner was Eucerin lotion; $14 at the pharmacy. Derms are using this as a base to compound HQ creams.

Here's the winning recipe I came up with for my 20% HQ cream:

1. In a heat proof pyrex glass measuring cup (1 cup size), place 3 level tablespoons of Eucerin lotion

* NOT the cream: it is too thick. Trust me. It takes too long to absorb so the HQ in it, while it sits there on your skin, oxidizes & you don't get the full benefits- unless you're trying to lighten the air in your bathroom!
*

2. Add 1 level TBSP of 100% HQ crystalline powder (work quickly to minimize air exposure!).

3. Now quickly add 2 TBSP of Eucerin cream covering the HQ entirely.

4. Cover your mixture with plastic wrap leaving a small opening for steam to escape.

5. Place in an opaque pot on the stove filled with water to the level of the cream in your measuring cup. This will ensure not too rapid but even heating. Turn the turn heat up to med-high. THe water will boil, heating & melting the cream & HQ.

6. After the water has been boiling for a good 10 mins, use a thermometer (a meat or candy thermometer works as well as a fancy scientific one) to check temp. It MUST reach 170 degrees. Once it has done so, remove plastic wrap BUT keep the mixture on the hot burner & stir carefully & thoroughly (I use cheap disposeable chop-stick for this!). Replace plastic & allow to boil a little longer (5 mins worked for me).

7. Remove pot from heat & allow to cool in the measuring cup, in the water with the plastic on.

* There WILL be some de-emulsification of the oily ingredients in the Eucerin. This'll look browny/goldish oily & odd. Don't worry! Stir ir together now & then & as it cools, it all reemulsifies: promise! Your cream will be the slightly off-white pale 'stone/cream' colour of the raw HQ powder (it is NOT pure white). In 4% concentrations, this doesn't show in the white base cream. When the measuring cup is warm enough to handle, QUICKLY pour your mixture into an opaque pump bottle ( a couple of $ each at makingcosmeticsdotcom)

You'll have a 1 week supply for all over your body at 2x/day. Do NOT mix more as it'll turn brown on you. This sounds complicated but it is fast & easy to mix. Once it is near room temp, it is ready to use!

I'll begin a new thread to post my testing process & results to-date as thiss is getting loonnngg (
Sorry!). I would NEVER have shared this recipe unless I'd tried it, tested it & could confirm my results.
 

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Wow seems like you got a winning recipe

How long have you been using it, i know usually you try stuff out for like a month or so
before you post...& have you noticed any results, compared to using the SW?
 

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Discussion Starter #4
1/5 of a whole = 20%

In the 2nd thread on this topic, I mention more re results. This thread wad already too l,ong but since it was about compounding, it had to be detailed & clear enough.
 

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im confused, the recipe u listed was for 20% HQ and u said to add 1 tablespoon of HQ crystalline powder, and now its 1/5th of a whole tablespoon?

- and in the first step you said place 3 LEVEL tablespoons into the pyrex measuring cup, 3 level? that means 3 tablespoonfulls of eucerin lotion?



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Thank you, Ondine! I'm going to have to tweak it a bit for it to last a week for me.
 

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Congrats Odine! I remember coming across an old thread before through google where it seemed to be to dermatologists were speaking about an Hq recipe and one of the main ingredients was using Eucerine. So, I see that is an important ingredient to use along with Hq. Is it possible to make a recipe large enough where the Hq formula will last up to 4 weeks?
 

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Amazing Ondine, so great of you to share this!!! I dont use Eucerin, but if I opt to use a lotion i use E45 and you are right about using the lotion and not the cream.

I mix a week/fortnights worth aswell and also advise people not to mix more than this.

I also note that you did not need to dissolve your HQ in a carrier. I take it the Eucerin works well enough as an emulsifier and carrier given its ingredients?
 

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^^^^ Ninasky what you doing up at 4Am??
lol Thanks alot ondine. I have one question, in the " boiling bath" do you put the measuring cup directly in there and let the bottom touch the bottome of the pot? Does this not burn the measuring cup, would this work with a double boiler to prevent this?
 

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Discussion Starter #10
LightenNLift,

If you take any amt of anything, divide it into 5 equal parts, then 1 part will = 1/5th of the whole. So...if you take a 5 TBSP total of cream & replace 1TBSP of the cream with 1 TBSP of HQ powder, you get a 20% concentration. Is that better? I'll go back to see if I made a typo somewhere in that long post re the QTY's.

Thanks for catching my typo, LNL. I DID make a mistake (NOT in my compounding process but in typing it out!) Sorry about that, guys!

CORRECTION: 1 tbsp HQ to 4 tbsp EUCERIN.

place 2 tbsp eucerin in the measuring cup add 1 tbsp HQ crystals then top off with 2 tbsp eucerin.
 

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thanks ondine, and regarding safety, how did you open up the HQ packet and take out the powder, mine is in a big packet if I open it then it gets in contact with air instantly



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Discussion Starter #13
Mine is in a plastic bag with a twist tie inside of a big opaque white jar with a screw-on lid. Unless you have state of the art lab equipment & can work in a dark vacuum env't, then some air will touch your HQ. You need to minimize this by working quickly & efficiently. Have everything ready to streamline your process. You don't want to be fumbling around for your tools. Store your remaining HQ in a plastic bag where you can squeeze all the air out & twist-tie it tightly. Then put the bag into an opaque container.
 

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wow......were're making leaps and bounds! I'm soo interested in compounding lol.....just for the fun of it cuz the 4% is working for me. But this seems really cool. I can actually find both E45 Eucerin in my local drugstore. As for the HQ....hmmmm i think i could check some local photography shops....not sure though how to approach them and ask : "do you sell HQ?" lol i mean, how DO you go around asking for that :p
 

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Discussion Starter #15
I knew that between us, we would be able to get this figured out & in short order too.

-my measuring cup did NOT burn at this temp but you could use a dbl boiler as an alternative BUT that equipment could NEVER be used for anything else afterwards. I intend to buy some proper lab equipment for compounding over time. I am looking at sources. Many do not sell to private citizens & many have minimum qty's. A bulk purchase wouldn't be viable for us since we're scattered all over the globe. If, for ex, there were 20 of us in Canada or Grt Britain etc. we could arrange a big purchase, divide it up & share the cost evenly. Instead of measuring cups, scientific beakers would be preferable too since the measurements are more precise.

We'll tweak this as we go along.

LNL made an important point somewhere re Eucerin & the solubility of HQ in it (thus negating the need for dissolving it ahead of time in a carrier). EUCERIN contains propylene glycol already. Many lotions do BUT they also contain other agents that make the cream sit on the skin & not be absorbed. EUCERIN is a cream often prescribed to proriasis & eczema sufferers. It contains ingredients that ARE absorbed by the skin so we know for sure that the HQ's absorption will NOT be impeded by this base. Be sure the base LOTION (NOT cream) you use is one intended for absorption not purely cosmetic effects. EUCERIN is one being used by derms & pharms to in compounding HQ creams. Many add a 0.05% RA concentration to this. Raw RA is available from some suppliers but I've yet to find a source I feel comfortable using. Too many seemed dodgy. For now, for those of you who like using RA & tolerate it well, use LNL's idea & apply the HQ cream, wait a little, then apply the RA.
 

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Lucky for me and all other new yorkers, we have a PURE hydroquinone source right at our backyard, its called the B&H store, its a HUGE store that sells and trade everything related to photography, film, stock, television, eletronics, etc with a bigger warehouse of hte stuff, I just went there today and went to the DARK ROOM section and just asked straight up that I need HQ, it took a minute for hte guy to come back with it from hte warehouse and it was 7.95 for 100 grams in a white plastic opaque jar. This store is at 33rd streeth between and 9th avenue. this is hte link hydroquinone, btw its a a stock market there, i had no idea that many people do business with films/photohraphy/stock its.



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Discussion Starter #17
That's really convenient. Anyone living in the USA can have a friend or relative in NY pick up some & send it to them. I bet that there are photograpger's supply shoppes in most cities selling this stuff. Kodak can let you know where the vendors are in your area. Many derms are getting it from them.
 

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Lucky for me and all other new yorkers, we have a PURE hydroquinone source right at our backyard, its called the B&H store, its a HUGE store that sells and trade everything related to photography, film, stock, television, eletronics, etc with a bigger warehouse of hte stuff, I just went there today and went to the DARK ROOM section and just asked straight up that I need HQ, it took a minute for hte guy to come back with it from hte warehouse and it was 7.95 for 100 grams in a white plastic opaque jar. This store is at 33rd streeth between and 9th avenue. this is hte link hydroquinone, btw its a a stock market there, i had no idea that many people do business with films/photohraphy/stock its.
Thanks for the referral. since I cant buy the one you bought (100g) what do you suggest? To go with multiple 10g's? I want to order the supplies to.. this is very scary for me, but i will be as careful as I know how..
 

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u cant buy the one I bought because they dont ship it out, but buy the one that they actually ship out from their website, idk why photography companies are so iffy about delivery, guess they dont want any liabilities since this stuff is so pure/reactive.



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